共1页/7条首页上一页1下一页尾页
回复:88 阅读:11896
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
楼主 发表于 2010-07-27 22:39|举报|关注(0)
浏览排序[ 顺序 逆序 楼主 支持 精彩 ]  快捷回复
姓    名: ××× 性别:   年龄:  74岁
标本名称:  
简要病史:  排尿困难15年,尿潴留3天
肉眼检查:  血TPSA25.66ng/ml,血fPSA5.74ng/ml
如何诊断?
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?图1
名称:图1
描述:图1
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?图2
名称:图2
描述:图2
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?图3
名称:图3
描述:图3
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?图4
名称:图4
描述:图4
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?图5
名称:图5
描述:图5
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?图6
名称:图6
描述:图6
20100727- 前列腺穿刺够癌吗?图7
名称:图7
描述:图7
标签:
0
添加参考诊断
×参考诊断
  

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
1 楼    发表于2010-09-11 22:08:00举报|引用
返回顶部 | 快捷回复
以下是引用海上明月在2010-9-11 19:47:00的发言:

 请楼主张主任说说贵单位的意见。谢谢!

谢谢,印象中是这样的:前列腺穿刺组织4条,大部分呈前列腺增生改变,灶性小腺泡不典型增生,高度可疑腺癌,建议进一步检查。
0
回复

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
2 楼    发表于2010-09-01 14:34:00举报|引用
返回顶部 | 快捷回复

 Should Pathologists Diagnose ‘‘Adenocarcinoma’’When They Encounter a Single Small Atypical
Focus in a Prostate Biopsy?
In Response:
Both Letters to the Editor referring to our paper ‘‘Variability in diagnostic opinion among pathologists for
single small atypical foci in prostate biopsies’’ challenge its recommendation to obtain second opinion of a specialist pathologist before making a diagnosis of adenocarcinoma on a focus, comprising
5 or less atypical acini.4 Dr Dalton1 argues that the clinical outcome of men with these lesions, irrespective
of the diagnosis, is any how favorable.His view seems to be further corroborated by another paper recently published in this Journal5 on false negative prostate biopsies that is, biopsies where the diagnosis of prostate cancer was missed. The missed lesions were small foci of Gleason score 6 (3 +3) denocarcinomas in a single biopsy. Indeed,none of the men with a false-negative biopsy seemed to have a cancer advanced beyond the curable stage at the time of prostate cancer diagnosis 4 to 8 years later and the cancers did not differ from those found in men with a previous truly negative biopsy result.
To our opinion, the argument raised by Dr Dalton1 might be valid at a population level, but may not apply
for the individual man, in whom the small atypical focus could represent the tip of the iceberg, requiring
additional clinical investigations. As literature has shown that intercollegial consultation leads to more definite diagnoses of benign or cancer in prostate biopsies,3 we maintain our recommendation on this matter.The reason for the disagreement of Drs Gilks and Huntsmans2 with our position is the lack of consensus among the experts themselves. On account of this lack of agreement on the diagnosis
of such small foci, no individual expert can function as a ‘‘golden standard’’and therefore, they propose that pathologists should refrain from making a definite diagnosis of cancer when the number of atypical acini does not exceed a given number, for example, 10 acini. In contrast, we would argue that not all lesions with fewer than 6 atypical acini in our study suffered from a lack of consensus among experts, and in average the experts did better than the general pathologists of our study. The proportion
of consensus in these cases might in fact be higher in a real-life situation as compared with this virtual microscopy environment, for reasons outlined in the discussion of our paper. Thus, we do not agree with
a recommendation that would deny a pathologist’s right to render a definite diagnosis of adenocarcinoma when he would feel comfortable enough to do so. Obviously, we endorse the view
that the scientific community should continue to look for additional tools to reduce the diagnostic uncertainty on these small atypical foci. In the mean time, we would encourage pathologists
to seek advice from specialist pathologists to reduce the uncertainty of their diagnosis under these circumstances.

Theodorus H. Van der Kwast, MD,
PhD*
Jonathan I. Epstein, MD, PhDw
*Department of Pathology University
Health Network Toronto, Canada
wDepartment of Pathology
The Johns Hopkins Medical Institutions
Baltimore, MD

0
回复

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
3 楼    发表于2010-09-01 14:27:00举报|引用
返回顶部 | 快捷回复
本帖最后由 于 2010-09-01 14:36:00 编辑
以下是引用海上明月在2010-9-1 13:08:00的发言:

 欢迎原单位意见。

如有后续手术证实就好。

谢谢!

感谢各位网友非常有见地的剖析,收益匪浅,国内和国外一样到究竟是“小腺泡非典型增生”还是“腺癌”的争议仍在进行中,在“Variability in diagnostic opinion among pathologists for single small atypical foci in prostate biopsies ”发表后不久Am J Surg Pathol  Volume 34, Number 7, July 2010 又发表了一封读者来信“Diagnostic Uncertainty in the Interpretation of Small Atypical Acinar Lesions of Prostate”

To the Editor:

The recently published article by Van der Kwast et al1 presents interesting and important data on diagnosis of small atypical foci on prostate needle biopsies. The authors show that these small foci are not reliably diagnosed by community
pathologists (k—0.21), with only slightly better performance by recognized
experts in the field (k—0.39).Not surprisingly, the results are worse (ie, consensus is particularly evasive)for the smallest foci under consideration,consisting of 5 or fewer acini.The authors are to be commended for a carefully designed study with the participation of leading experts in prostate pathology. We write, however,to take strenuous issue with the conclusion as stated in the abstract;the authors ‘‘encourage pathologists to obtain intercollegial consultation of a specialist pathologist for these lesions before a carcinoma diagnosis.’’Why? This conclusion is not supported by their data. Even if shown to an expert, the diagnosis would depend on which expert one chose as a consultant, and we have no way of knowing which consultant is right in a given case. We would interpret their results as follows: (1)small foci of 5 or fewer glands cannot be reproducibly diagnosed as benign versus malignant, even by experts,and therefore (2) major treatment decisions should not be made based on such small foci, given the lack of reproducibility of diagnosis. We see
no benefit to the patient of obtaining an expert opinion in such a case.The underlying issue is how reproducible the diagnosis of a given histopathologic variable must be to use it to guide therapy. We are not aware of this being formally discussed or rigorously examined, yet it is critical. It is a highly complex issue,requiring consideration of the nature of the treatment options, but a few recent examples are available for consideration. In the case of administration of adjuvant therapy in breast cancer, American Society of Clinical Oncology/College of American Pathologists guidelines call for test accuracy (agreement with independent reference method) of 95% for HER2 testing. Frozen section has an acceptable accuracy of greater than 98%.The diagnosis of single small atypical acini on prostate biopsies falls well short of these standards. As we move to evidence-based treatment  ecisions,greater reproducibility will be expected of pathologists. We should be prepared to state when we are not able to render reproducible diagnoses,as our opinions remain critical in treatment planning, and our credibility is eroded if we pretend all diagnoses are equal, in terms of reproducibility.The authors have clearly identified a circumstance where a diagnosis of carcinoma is not possible with certainty,an important step forward.We should now search for tools that will objectively predict patient outcome in such cases, and not fall back on reliance on subjective expert opinion for these small atypical acinar lesions.


C. Blake Gilks, MD, FRCPC
David G. Huntsman, MD
Department of Pathology
Vancouver General Hospital and British
Columbia Cancer Agency
Canada

0
回复

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
4 楼    发表于2010-08-25 14:00:00举报|引用
返回顶部 | 快捷回复
 病理学家在诊断前列腺活检单个不典型小病灶方面存在差异
0
回复

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
5 楼    发表于2010-08-25 13:58:00举报|引用
返回顶部 | 快捷回复
以下是引用xljin8在2010-8-25 12:42:00的发言:

 

前列腺活检组织中单个不典型病灶(上述文献定义为直径小于1mm) 与癌的鉴别是病理诊断的难题。张主任提供的文献已很好的证明此点。即使是训练有素、有丰富经验的专家,对这种病例的诊断一致性不到50%、而普通病理医生诊断的一致性仅30%。

这种情况在教科书中称为不典型小腺泡增生(Atypical small acinar proliferation, ASAP), 与癌的鉴别诊断并不能根据一项指标, 而要综合分析结构(Pattern)、细胞学、生长方式、和IHC标记。可疑腺泡的数量越少、结构与邻近正常腺泡越接近,诊断就越困难。在前列腺活检中ASAP的发生率约为3%,其中45%经泌尿病理专家会诊可明确诊断。如果患者年龄小于75岁,可建议再次活检,大于75岁,可由临床医生和患者讨论是否再活检。

病理学家越来越多地遇到前列腺活检小的不典型病灶,在腺癌、不典型小腺泡增生高度可疑恶性和良性诊断方面要求不同,作者按照欧洲前列腺癌随机法筛选研究(ERSPC) 对这种不典型病灶在泌尿病理学家和ERSPC病理学家之间进行了同一标准研究。这些病变多数包含2–5 个不典型腺体。泌尿病理专家诊断腺癌(49%)的比ERSPC病理学家诊断腺癌(32%)的更多(P<0.001)。作者建议病理学家在作出腺癌诊断之前,当诊断标准不足尤其是病灶少于6 个腺体时,应获得专科病理学家的会诊意见。而临床医生在准备延期或者确定治疗之前可以考虑再检。
0
回复

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
6 楼    发表于2010-08-24 16:51:00举报|引用
返回顶部 | 快捷回复
以下是引用海上明月在2010-8-24 12:50:00的发言:

 请楼主张主任发表贵单位意见。谢谢!

谢谢王主任的关注,在回答问题之前让我们共同学习一下有关内容:

Variability in Diagnostic Opinion Among Pathologists
for Single Small Atypical Foci in Prostate Biopsies

(Am J Surg Pathol 2010;00:000–000)

Abstract: Pathologists are increasingly exposed to prostate
biopsies with small atypical foci, requiring differentiation
between adenocarcinoma, atypical small acinar proliferation
suspicious for malignancy, and a benign diagnosis. We studied
the level of agreement for such atypical foci among experts in
urologic pathology and all-round reference pathologists of the
European Randomized Screening study of Prostate Cancer
(ERSPC). For this purpose, we retrieved 20 prostate biopsies
with small (most <1 mm) atypical foci. Hematoxylin and eosinstained
slides, including 10 immunostained slides were digitalized
for virtual microscopy. The lesional area was not marked.
Five experts and 7 ERSPC pathologists examined the cases.
Multirater k statistics was applied to determine agreement and
significant differences between experts and ERSPC pathologists.
The k value of experts (0.39; confidence interval, 0.29-0.49) was
significantly higher than that of ERSPC pathologists (0.21;
confidence interval, 0.14-0.27). Full (100%) agreement was
reached by the 5 experts for 7 of 20 biopsies. Experts and
ERSPC pathologists rendered diagnoses ranging from benign
to adenocarcinoma on the same biopsy in 5 and 9 biopsies,
respectively. Most of these lesions comprised between 2 and 5
atypical glands. The experts diagnosed adenocarcinoma (49%)
more often than the ERSPC pathologists (32%) (P<0.001). As
agreement was particularly poor for foci comprising <6 glands,
we would encourage pathologists to obtain intercollegial consultation
of a specialized pathologist for these lesions before a
carcinoma diagnosis, whereas clinicians may consider to perform
staging biopsies before engaging on deferred or definite therapy.
Key Words: prostate cancer, prostate biopsy, pathology,
diagnostics, interobserver variation, virtual microscopy

0
回复

shandongzhang 离线

帖子:804
粉蓝豆:506
经验:1510
注册时间:2006-09-24
加关注  |  发消息
7 楼    发表于2010-08-21 07:39:00举报|引用
返回顶部 | 快捷回复
本帖最后由 于 2010-08-21 07:40:00 编辑
以下是引用xljin8在2010-8-20 5:55:00的发言:

 

楼主能否提供IHC标记结果,谢谢!

IHC分别为:CK903,P63,P504S

名称:图1
描述:图1

名称:图2
描述:图2

名称:图3
描述:图3
0
回复
回复:88 阅读:11896
共1页/7条首页上一页1下一页尾页
【免责声明】讨论内容仅作学术交流之用,不作为诊疗依据,由此而引起的法律问题作者及本站不承担任何责任。
快速回复
进入高级回复
您最多可输入10000个汉字,按 "Ctrl" + "Enter" 直接发送
搜索回复/乘电梯 ×
按内容
按会员
乘电梯
合作伙伴
友情链接